HomePat I was just wondering if there is gonna be anything that will be transfered between maps like money items builds and so forth? If there are different things for donors than for members please tell us that too.
+5
thefluffyswan
_Brain_Dead_
Boblobster
mcuser12
CheeseXman
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new map questions
CheeseXman- Member
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mcuser12- Owner
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On 1.5 everything will be wiped.
Boblobster- In-Game Admin
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Only thing I care about is an entirely new economy. Fuck mobs giving you money, mine that shit and sell it in the admin shop for half as much as you buy it for.
_Brain_Dead_- Member
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Boblobster wrote:Only thing I care about is an entirely new economy. Fuck mobs giving you money, mine that shit and sell it in the admin shop for half as much as you buy it for.
screw minening kill the mobs for money
Boblobster- In-Game Admin
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Boblobster wrote:Fuck mobs giving you money
Farming mobs for money is an absolutely ridiculous basis for an economy in minecraft.
thefluffyswan- Member
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Boblobster wrote:Boblobster wrote:Fuck mobs giving you money
Farming mobs for money is an absolutely ridiculous basis for an economy in minecraft.
How about we take minecraft-money
AND PUSH IT SOMEWHERE ELSE?
John_Axe- Member
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Cant wait for a new map...Altho mob farming is good, it makes people buy spawners and stuff..
mcuser12- Owner
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Mob farming is really not a viable way to do the economy--people just place weights on their mice and afk at a farm all day.
_Brain_Dead_- Member
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PatrickFreed wrote:Mob farming is really not a viable way to do the economy--people just place weights on their mice and afk at a farm all day.
how does that even work u need to click for each hit
Musiciscool- Member
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I used to have a mob grinder. I would grind to level 30 and have like 300 freeds each time i stepped out of the grinder (not that I ever spent it, seeing as the spawn was destroyed) Yes, mob farming does fuck up the economy because it just makes getting money too easy.
Boblobster- In-Game Admin
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Mob farming is not even conceivably good for any reason other than it's easy to get money that will henceforth be completely useless and not really acceptable enough for us to put 'iConomy' in the FreedsUniverse logo. Clicking is hardly a difficult task now. Trying to mine minerals like diamonds that you can then sell for money, and not keep the diamond (you know, like in real life with real economies) on the other hand, is more difficult and will present a more meaningful economy. Rather than 'YAAAAY I STOOD STILL FOR 3 HOURS AND STARTED CLICKING, NOW I HAVE MORE NUMBERS THAT I CAN'T DO ANYTHING WITH OTHER THAN SHOW PEOPLE HOW MUCH TIME I AM WILLING TO WASTE STANDING STILL AND CLICKING!!!!', and for those few who don't grind, they can't do much with their money because then everything is too expensive.
mcuser12- Owner
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I think the best point that bob made is the exchange:
If you sell a diamond at the shop, you no longer have that diamand, and the world no longer has that diamond. So there is a large amount of money in the overall pool, but it does not change, whereas with mobs, it is infinite and you trade nothing of your own besides time to receive it. Like you're basically generating money by farming mobs.
If you sell a diamond at the shop, you no longer have that diamand, and the world no longer has that diamond. So there is a large amount of money in the overall pool, but it does not change, whereas with mobs, it is infinite and you trade nothing of your own besides time to receive it. Like you're basically generating money by farming mobs.
Boblobster- In-Game Admin
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^
Nearbeer- Member
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Hey bob, instead of mob money because all the mob farm shit, let's make it so you get 1 freed a second, that way everyone will play! Oh wait, neither of them are different.
_Brain_Dead_- Member
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than make it like we had on orc only like 1 in 10mobs give u a little bit of money
Boblobster- In-Game Admin
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That's even more ridiculous, the people who don't farm would get 10 times less and those that do would still get stupid amounts because they'd just camp longer. There is no way to fix killing mobs for money without banning mob farming, and that's just a stupid route to take because people also farm for the materials you get as well, and that's vanilla.
Yeah you could say just remove it from a certain radius of a mob spawner, but then what about the people dungeon crawling? Surely they should get more if anything because they're more likely to die with an untamed spawner. If you banned doing it from those kind of spawners then people would just start building dark room mob spawners, I mean the worst kind of spawner doesn't even use the block in any way at all, endermen ones. We did do something to cut that down by averaging it so you get 1 to -1 freed each time, seeing as one town managed to get 400,000 freed doing it. Back in my day the highest balance was 18,000 freed and we all wondered how the hell he did that, back when noone mob farmed.
The only way to stop people exploiting getting money from mobs is by removing the system and replacing it with one that isn't retarded.
Yeah you could say just remove it from a certain radius of a mob spawner, but then what about the people dungeon crawling? Surely they should get more if anything because they're more likely to die with an untamed spawner. If you banned doing it from those kind of spawners then people would just start building dark room mob spawners, I mean the worst kind of spawner doesn't even use the block in any way at all, endermen ones. We did do something to cut that down by averaging it so you get 1 to -1 freed each time, seeing as one town managed to get 400,000 freed doing it. Back in my day the highest balance was 18,000 freed and we all wondered how the hell he did that, back when noone mob farmed.
The only way to stop people exploiting getting money from mobs is by removing the system and replacing it with one that isn't retarded.
Kukurin56- Member
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- Post n°17
Re: new map questions > Concerning spawners and the economy.
by Kukurin56 Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:11 pm
I’ve noticed that mining spawners now costs money, rather than grants it. Creaturebox is already a privileged ability I am very happy to have, so it makes sense that if one wishes to tame a box, or move one, that they pay some fee. Money for mobs however, is one way an economy gets so unbalanced in the first place. A higher radius of no-camping-spawners too often stops any benefit of mob-drops even for natural mobs, something I ran into far too often when I joined Orc in 1.2.5.
I’m not too sure about selling non-renewable resources for lower price. That is how shops usually, and should work, but if that is in place, there would have to be a way to get money from a renewable source. Unfortunately, this is where exploitation comes from. So there must to be a way to get money from a renewable resource, and keep that method from being exploited.
I may have an idea. There are three things creaturebox is used for right now: money, experience, and drops. No money for killing mobs, due to previously stated reasons. There is no longer an expbank, due to its exploits, which was ridiculous anyway, and needing to be rid of. Perhaps, an Admin shop could pay for the drops, and that be the renewable source. Because of spawners, it would have to be a large amount or so, for much less money. Or, maybe would it be possible to make creaturebox spawned mobs have much lower chance of having normal drops (Excluding the rare drops)? This could make it far more worth it to actually go out and kill mobs in the wild or underground, instead of camping a spawner.
Cobblestone and dirt, as vastly expendable as they are, could be sold to an admin shop for extremely low, especially cobble, and other materials naturally adjusted to their rareness and difficultly to obtain. I liked how Minecraft made other things give exp., mining, farming, the such, which awards players for the whole minecraft experience, instead of just slash and stab on mobs. The economy should reflect this too. Exp. is for enchanting exclusively, but a minecraft economy should cover the whole game, how a real one does.
One more thing, I do not think that spawners should be sold in admin shops, this makes WAY TOO MANY SPAWNERS. One thing I like about creaturebox is going out adventuring to find spawners naturally, neutralizing them, and capturing them (kind of like Pokemon I guess). I think the cave spider was the most abundant, but most dangerous to get, but it is plenty of fun trying to capture them.
I still don’t get why there’s no permission from chicken spawners. (Last thing, sorry.) At least for me on this map, I live on an island in the middle of the ocean, and know others do too. Living on an island makes it very hard to make an animal farm without the use of spawners. Just one though, can make a farm almost complete (no chicken perms, like I said).
I’m not too sure about selling non-renewable resources for lower price. That is how shops usually, and should work, but if that is in place, there would have to be a way to get money from a renewable source. Unfortunately, this is where exploitation comes from. So there must to be a way to get money from a renewable resource, and keep that method from being exploited.
I may have an idea. There are three things creaturebox is used for right now: money, experience, and drops. No money for killing mobs, due to previously stated reasons. There is no longer an expbank, due to its exploits, which was ridiculous anyway, and needing to be rid of. Perhaps, an Admin shop could pay for the drops, and that be the renewable source. Because of spawners, it would have to be a large amount or so, for much less money. Or, maybe would it be possible to make creaturebox spawned mobs have much lower chance of having normal drops (Excluding the rare drops)? This could make it far more worth it to actually go out and kill mobs in the wild or underground, instead of camping a spawner.
Cobblestone and dirt, as vastly expendable as they are, could be sold to an admin shop for extremely low, especially cobble, and other materials naturally adjusted to their rareness and difficultly to obtain. I liked how Minecraft made other things give exp., mining, farming, the such, which awards players for the whole minecraft experience, instead of just slash and stab on mobs. The economy should reflect this too. Exp. is for enchanting exclusively, but a minecraft economy should cover the whole game, how a real one does.
One more thing, I do not think that spawners should be sold in admin shops, this makes WAY TOO MANY SPAWNERS. One thing I like about creaturebox is going out adventuring to find spawners naturally, neutralizing them, and capturing them (kind of like Pokemon I guess). I think the cave spider was the most abundant, but most dangerous to get, but it is plenty of fun trying to capture them.
I still don’t get why there’s no permission from chicken spawners. (Last thing, sorry.) At least for me on this map, I live on an island in the middle of the ocean, and know others do too. Living on an island makes it very hard to make an animal farm without the use of spawners. Just one though, can make a farm almost complete (no chicken perms, like I said).
Last edited by Kukurin56 on Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:18 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Spelling mistake.)
Boblobster- In-Game Admin
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Yeah that was the plan in terms of the economy, sell all items to the admin shop more or less, but I don't think we should use cobble or dirt as sellable things because then people would end up just digging up all the ground and make the place a giant mess, however things like stone maybe, because that requires effort to smelt. We're (supposedly) gonna make the buy/sell ratio 2:1 as well to promote people making their own shops with better deals, so the money circulates about more and every works as a team, all that malarkey.
I was thinking also have things like wheat and carrots farmed for small money. Yeah people could easily exploit that by making masses of farms, but there again it stops eyesores being created by digging out all of the earth and it stops huge lag from like 12 billion mobs around at one time. They can't really afk for stupendous amounts of time either because plants dont grow infinitely, and they have to replant them all in the end. Basically actually farming to farm money takes a lot more effort so people are less likely to do it. They can only carry a full inventory to the market at a time too.
As for the spawning thing though, if we make it a lower chance from spawners they will still get the same amount as if they just went out killing purely because there are that many more mobs xD. When were spawners sold in shops anyway? I know the spawn eggs are sold but I don't think we have the plugin to make them into spawners. That was only on Orcworm as far as I know, then again we did basically take everything you had and slammed it on.
I was thinking also have things like wheat and carrots farmed for small money. Yeah people could easily exploit that by making masses of farms, but there again it stops eyesores being created by digging out all of the earth and it stops huge lag from like 12 billion mobs around at one time. They can't really afk for stupendous amounts of time either because plants dont grow infinitely, and they have to replant them all in the end. Basically actually farming to farm money takes a lot more effort so people are less likely to do it. They can only carry a full inventory to the market at a time too.
As for the spawning thing though, if we make it a lower chance from spawners they will still get the same amount as if they just went out killing purely because there are that many more mobs xD. When were spawners sold in shops anyway? I know the spawn eggs are sold but I don't think we have the plugin to make them into spawners. That was only on Orcworm as far as I know, then again we did basically take everything you had and slammed it on.
Kukurin56- Member
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Anything that is a renewable resource should be sold to the admin shop from much less then non-renewable ones. On your point of eye-sores, I agree. Dirt and cobble shouldn't be something to sell to adminshop. As for the farmers, would it be too complicated to have a rule of money crops being far enough from closely populated areas? I don't really know how big a farm for cash crops usually is, but I know my island farm produces plenty of crops, though I have no automated farming yet. People still have to replant to farm. Farming will take effort no matter what, so if it isn't too close to say a city where many people reside together, shouldn't they be allowed to have a large farm a fair depth in the wilderness?
You can't make spawners out of eggs on Freed huh? Well coming form Orcworm, I'm able to find spawners, mining into eggs, and turning back into spawners in a better location. Maybe an idea for the 1.5 server? If eggs are not sold in admin shops (I though they were, at least on Orc), but can be turned into spawners, then they would be a non-renewable resource, without making them too rare. That should help keep people from building ridiculously huge spawner rooms, because they actually have to go out and get the eggs from natural spawns, making the eggs actually something of value. It also helps ensure that island dwellers such as myself are actually able to make a farm without buying 8 expensive eggs, two of each animal, not counting if one of the animals dies in the starting process.
You can't make spawners out of eggs on Freed huh? Well coming form Orcworm, I'm able to find spawners, mining into eggs, and turning back into spawners in a better location. Maybe an idea for the 1.5 server? If eggs are not sold in admin shops (I though they were, at least on Orc), but can be turned into spawners, then they would be a non-renewable resource, without making them too rare. That should help keep people from building ridiculously huge spawner rooms, because they actually have to go out and get the eggs from natural spawns, making the eggs actually something of value. It also helps ensure that island dwellers such as myself are actually able to make a farm without buying 8 expensive eggs, two of each animal, not counting if one of the animals dies in the starting process.
Boblobster- In-Game Admin
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People can build crop farms wherever they fancy and as big as they fancy, as long as it takes effort to do and you can't afk it for hours it's a good idea to be sold pretty much. I mean there's even a limit to how big the farms are in that after a certain distance the chunk is inactive and they wont grow if you afk.
Kukurin56- Member
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Alright, that's good. But about the spawners and eggs, what do you think about that?
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